Re: Nothing is So Necessary [Cyrus, Ulv]

Sun Dec 22, 2019 5:11 pm

Cyrus

"That is a fair misunderstanding to make, I suppose. My faith is not one which is particularly widespread, nor has it been for some time. Still, the holy flames burn yet, so the time has yet to come for true lamentation."

It struck him that, though he had stood to leave, he had gone nowhere. He did not particularly enjoy that, yet he did not especially wish to leave just yet. Cyrus was, if nothing else, exceptionally polite, and leaving now would simply cut short the conversation. Besides it was...not unpleasant. He sat once more, and poured for himself another cup of tea.

"I cannot afford to fail, nor to worry about whether or not I feel human. I have always understood that I may well need to give everything away for the sake of doing good. There is no grief for me in it."

Sun Dec 22, 2019 5:33 pm

ULV AUBER| WHITE MASK BUDDHA

"Failing in the small things is fine. It grows character. Failing in the big things does to but cripples what you might learn under what you lose in the process. Still, you giving up everything that is a human and operating off a memory is a very bad idea in the long run. Sure if you had a human's life span and were going to be in the ground in thirty years it would be fine. But Rakki still looks beautiful a thousand years after she was born. You'll want, you'll need more than just a memory of a thought of what you want.

A person's emotions are their greatest treasure. And a God, that must embody the greatest aspects of their creation, must have the greatest emotions. The greatest desires, the greatest regrets. Else what are they but a tool? I have no problem being a tool, but a tool must be wielded, and you have nobody but yourself to wield you"

FLAME OF HOPE | END POST

Mon Dec 23, 2019 5:53 pm

Cyrus

"A God fails in his duty if he does not give everything for his creation. He exists for the people he has deigned to shepherd. If he does not, he can be called only evil, nothing to be worthy of praise.

I do not claim that a God must sacrifice their everything for some impossible dream of perfection. It is irresponsible to dream for such a thing, and evil to force a world of absolute tranquility upon those who have the ability to choose for themselves. But my own humanity is a small price to pay for all others. Whether I exist for 10 more years for the rest of eternity, there is no regret to be had in this choice."

Mon Dec 23, 2019 6:00 pm

ULV AUBER| WHITE MASK BUDDHA

"That seems more like a slave than a God. A God should not give up themselves for those that he has made. Aid rendered when they ask, sure. But to give up everything and exist for the people? That seems to invite over-reliance on the God. A lack of understanding of risk because they know that the God will just fix it for them.

You say the world has the ability to choose for themselves, but if you are always there to clean up the mess of a bad choice, then what will they learn? Other than the fact that there is no consequence to picking the wrong choice so just do what you want because he will fix it for us"

FLAME OF HOPE | END POST

Mon Dec 23, 2019 6:20 pm

Cyrus

"There is no value in a God who simply corrects for mistakes made, I agree. Those who make poor choices deserve to learn from them, those who make good choices deserve to thrive. I do not wish to see a world in which I should step in often.

The world has every right to operate within its own bounds. Indeed, I wish to see it do so, to watch its full possibilities unfold without any intervention on my behalf. But the world as it currently exists has not been born of the people's wishes or efforts. It has simply come here through constant strife, through the endless conflict of forces that most cannot understand. It is unjust, something that they do not deserve. That is the role of a God. To give the people such lives that their decisions in life have meaning, whether good or ill."

Mon Dec 23, 2019 7:38 pm

ULV AUBER| WHITE MASK BUDDHA

"Constant strife is many people's wishes and efforts. Demons have had their hand in politics for a metaphysical blink of an eye, so they are hardly to blame for the ills of everything ever. You rescue Earth from everyone that wishes to do it ill. Kick out the Demons, throw away the Shinigami, dispose of every Hollow in existence. And you know what'll happen? The humans turn on themselves. With great fury and vigour will they rip at themselves eternal once again. You think I am bad with violent desires and terrible need to obliterate all my foes then find new foes?" Ulv shook her head softly and sipped her tea.

"Problem with trying to make a utopia on Earth is the humans. The more freedom they get, the more you need to intervene as their Shepard. They don't need outside intervention to commit attrocites to their own people for the greater good, for their country. For more power. For the fun of it"

FLAME OF HOPE | END POST

Tue Dec 24, 2019 2:05 am

Cyrus

"Then such people will be culled in time. It is one thing to ruin one's own life through poor decision making, but another entirely to ruin the lives of others. Humanity has fought itself for centuries, millennia. I would not deny what is such obvious truth. Nor, for that matter, would I deny that it is an inevitable fact of life. 'Man must suffer to be wise,' as Cicero said."

Cyrus paused a moment to pour himself another cup of tea, idly wishing for a brief moment that he had thought to bring any of his own. He suspected he might be here a bit longer yet, and it would have been nice to offer that to Ulv in turn.

"Utopia is a concept that I do not concern myself with. Mankind does not require outside intervention to ruin themselves, this is true. But there is a wide gulf between cataclysmic war and simple political strife. If I must step in to keep the world from true annihilation, then such is my role. But I fundamentally disagree that all of humanity is so cruel as to work toward such a goal.

"All that I desire is to create a world in which things are not so chaotic. Demons, shinigami, even hollows have their place in the natural order of things. If they did not, then they would not have been present since time immemorial. But the status quo that lasted so very long was not changed by the actions of man. Would they have destroyed themselves? Perhaps. But we cannot know that. I will not condemn them for what may have been."

Tue Dec 24, 2019 7:50 am

ULV AUBER| WHITE MASK BUDDHA

"So which is it, Cyrus? Force a world of absolute tranquility upon those who have the ability to choose for themselves, or let the people constantly fuck shit up? Because the first one is what regular culling of the evil beings will cause. A state of alarm and fear that anyone could be killed at any moment because of their actions. A jittering, terrified populace being nice and polite until the bubble bursts and they explode into a glorious revolution that is then squashed under heel and cows people in fear and despair until they can take it no more and they explode into a glorious revolution that is then squashed under heel"

She finished her tea and sent the cup floating back to the side, the teabag, milk and kettle making her a new one before floating it back. It was helpful, being the city. She had a level of control over everything infused with her reiatsu, which was handy for tea and when the remote was on the other side of the couch.

"I can get behind stepping in to stop Humanity wiping itself out entirely, but then what is the point of that? You are just torturing them at that point. Keeping them alive so they may enact a billion cruelties upon themselves. Not every man is cruel, true, but the majority tend towards cruelty. Unshackle man from the fetters of Law and he becomes a beast"

FLAME OF HOPE | END POST

Tue Dec 24, 2019 3:02 pm

Cyrus

"I would not deign to cull the every day unfortunate realities of life. Murder, robbery, all other crimes which occur in the natural course of one's life, those are simply things I cannot control, nor would I deign to do so. But total world war which would wipe away mankind altogether? I think that would be something else entirely. What do you wish me to say, Ulv? That there is some unifying, absolute basic principle that all judgements must follow? I think you and I are both keenly aware that, at the end of the day, what can and cannot be allowed could only ever be decided in context. Hypotheticals and postulations can never be enough."

The motion and remaking of the teapot interested Cyrus to a small degree, enough so that he idly made a note to ask Ninsianna to look into something similar.

"Were that true, Ulv, man never would have achieved civilization in the first place. Humanity was not placed upon the Earth already existing in some prebuilt society. He began as a savage, came up over tens of thousands of years from little more than an animal. And despite his failings, his cruelties, his sins and his hardships, he still built the world as we know it. Law is not an abstract concept by which man was bound. It is something that they create for themselves."

Tue Dec 24, 2019 3:20 pm

ULV AUBER| WHITE MASK BUDDHA

"Given how they are, I am amazed they got so far. I can only think they were ignorant of what they could do until they did it. At which point there was too much in place for them to really open up. But, I am cynical like that, and that's the problem. It's a dangerous path to start walking down. It's why I refuse to impose my will on things. Why I must draw a line at the choice of the person. When you start judging what is allowed and what is not, it is a slope so slippery. And many times worse when you have the power to force such change on the world. When a full release of your strength can cow an entire country with nothing but your presence. The weight of power gets to you, and then you come to realise you are not a good person. Good people don't need rules"

She stared at the tea cup she had for a few moments and then looked back up to Cyrus.
"Sticking your fingers into humanity's pie is a risky move at the best of times. Just, make sure you've got friends to talk to. Friends that will tell you when you are turning into a detached tyrant, friends who aren't afraid of you. People will frustrate you and disappoint you and cause you to feel like they are not worth the endless effort you put in for them. You'll feel you are making progress then some twat will go and fucking nuke a civilian city!"

Ulv's eyes flashed a crimson colour and the room became swelteringly hot for a few moments before the oppressive source of the heat retreated, leaving only the cooling room. Clearly, she had a rather personal stake in all this.
"And then you'll see a young girl, scared and confused but pushing it back anyway to help the people that need helping. And all of it comes rushing back. The whole reason you set out to do this in the first place, and the reason you keep doing it, despite everything"

FLAME OF HOPE | END POST